Bukavu, 01 July 2011 - Since May 2011, the South Kivu Brigade launched four military operations, each lasting two weeks and they were given different names. The goals of these different operations are not always clearly understood by the population who would, on the contrary, like MONUSCO to conduct one big unilateral operation to chase out all the armed groups.

To tell us about the Why and How of these operations, the South Kivu Brigade Commander, Brigadier General Mohammad Jamil, accepted to talk to our Public Information Officer in Bukavu, South Kivu Province :

PIO (Question): Brigadier-General Mohammad Jamil, you are the Commander of the South Kivu Brigade. Since May this year, you launched a number of operations in South Kivu. What exactly are you trying to achieve through these operations?

SKB Commander: First of all, thank you very much for giving me the opportunity to explain my position. You know that after the FARDC [Congolese Armed Forces] decided to go for reintegration, they pulled their troops out of the area where they were deployed earlier. So initially, they went for regrouping the five regiments and now there are still eight regiments which are undergoing training. So when these people vacated these areas just like that, there was great concern amongst the locals for their protection. And people even started approaching our COBs [Company Operating Bases} which are in the fields, informing us that now that the as the FARDC had left, they would be going in the bush as there will be attacks on the villages. So the situation becomes alarming. FARDC was not in a position to abandon the training and go back to those areas, because they are following a very comprehensive plan for reorganization and reintegration. So, just to pacify the locals, just to reassure them that MONUSCO is there with a mandate to protect the civilians, we decided to fill in those voids, those gaps by undertaking various protective measures, various defensive measures. And we gave them various names. These were defensive in nature, and FARDC was not in a position to join hands with us. So these were in a way unilateral defensive operations within the mandate — our mandate — of protecting the civilians.

PIO: General, we understand that you have launched quick operations lasting two weeks approximately, and that you are also giving different names to these operations. What are the criteria for choosing such names?

SKB Commander: Well, first of all, these operations are at the tactical level, and the criterion for choosing these names is that, basically, we would like to give them local names, and names which reassure the locals that these are operations which are aimed at protecting them, which are aimed at providing them with additional security, which are aimed at giving them peace, which are aimed at assuring them that MONUSCO is there to protect them. So if you see the names of all these small operations, you will agree with me that this is the message that we wanted to send across.

PIO: Don't you think that you are sending the wrong message? Because the population is thinking that you are changing the names because the previous operations were not successful?

SKB Commander: Well, this is a matter of perception. I understand that here people are familiar with operations like Operation Amani Leo, like Operation Kimia, which would last for years. So, if you are seeing it from that perspective and if you want to equate it with that, I would advise you or I would suggest that you take it that we are undertaking a peacekeeping operation. And now these operations which we are talking about are minor operations, are tactical-level operations of a very short duration. We see a pattern, let's say, two to three weeks, where there are HRVs [Human Rights Violations] and we monitor them; then we take inputs from various humanitarian agencies also. We take input from our Civil Affairs Section also. And then, wherever there are gaps, wherever security is deteriorating, we undertake these operations. So in no way they should be considered as a success or a failure. And I can tell you that the major success of these operations is that wherever we went, wherever we launched these operations, the locals were not displaced because of the void created by the FARDC. So, if you see it in that context, we have been very successful.

PIO: General, are you conducting these operations with other UN special forces or with the FARDC?

SKB Commander: Well, first of all, we are here to support the law-enforcement agencies of the DRC [Democratic Republic of the Congo]. Here, in this particular case, FARDC was not in a position, because of their ongoing training, to take part in these operations. And these operations were primarily conducted to fill in the gaps, to fill the voids created by the FARDC when they went for the training. When FARDC was not in the process of reintegration -- you know, last November, December and January -- we were undertaking joint operations with them --- 15 of them in all. But in these particular cases, FARDC was not in a position to join in. But when we started these operations, I had a meeting with the commander of Amani Leo and I told him that this was what we were going to do and I even [explained] the same thing to the governor of South Kivu when he expressed some concerns. The Deputy Force Commander and myself had a meeting with him and I explained our intention to him, that we want to fill in the gap, that we were undertaking various operations. Well, here in this operation, all the UN forces here which are in the South Kivu, are involved. It includes the Pakistani contingent; it includes the Egyptian Special Forces; it includes the Aviation Air Assets, which are under my command; it includes the attack helicopters. All the forces at my disposal undertake these operations. Even the Riverine component from Uruguay, are now deployed in Lake Tanganyika. Earlier, they were only in Lake Kivu. So they would operate in that. All these forces are at my disposal. They're duly incorporated in these operations.

PIO: What are the results of those operations, taking into account that the FDLR and Mai Mai groups have reoccupied some of these positions where the FARDC vacated and are now committing attrocities? I can give you the name of some localities, like Nyambembe in Shabunda, Ninja in Kabare and so many localities in Mwenga.

SKB Commander: Well, as you are aware, the province of South Kivu has an area of something like 65,000 km2. The areas that you have mentioned are three to four localities, and even if you monitor the pattern of the atrocities that you are talking about, you would see that it is basically looting and theft incidents. The results of these operations were that, by and large, in the province... You see, the FARDC troops are something like 18,000 in this province. Then all these people get out of the areas, and you know, at the moment, something like eight to 10,000 people who are undergoing training. So then, they vacate the areas, the entire province would have been all taken by the FDLR. But it has not happened. Why hasn't it happened? That is simply because we were there to fill the gaps. And there are all the humanitarian agencies that are watching this. And I am quite satisfied that no major atrocities like rapes as a weapon of war or ransacking of villages which used to happen before have taken place. You know, that is why UN troops are here. So these kinds of incidents have been avoided. There has been no major displacement, even in Shabunda, even in Mwenga. You see, there's no major displacement that one should be alarmed that it has taken place. So we have filled these gaps, and I am very positive that by the time the FARDC return after the training on 30 June, I'm very hopeful that life is going to be returning to normal.

PIO: Will you be ready to use force, I mean to open fire, to protect the civilian population in those areas where you are conducting the operations?

SKB Commander: Well, first of all, let it be very clear, that we are not here to fight a war. We're here to keep the peace and we have a mandate which is peacekeeping and protection of civilians. Then, we are undertaking joint operations with the FARDC. FARDC goes in; we are in the fire-support role. And then, to open fire, how to open fire, you will agree with me that it depends upon the situation. But we, when under attack, we, as by the UN rules, have the right to self-defense.

PIO: General, the populations in the areas where the FDLR or the Mai Mai have occupied FARDC position are saying that they don't really feel that your operations are protecting them. They are saying that all the areas reoccupied by these groups have not been freed by your operations. They have the impression that you are just there patrolling on the main roads.

SKB Commander: Well, if you see the previous pattern, like, for example, I will give you the example of Fizi when rape occurred there. I visited that area after the incident occurred and it was totally deserted. All the shops were closed and nobody was there. So this perception that you are giving me, I may not agree with that for the reason that whenever there is an occupation, as you are suggesting, of the FDLR, or major attacks by the FDLR, the pattern over here is that people leave the villages and they go in the jungles, in the bush. But as a result of recent ongoing integration by the FARDC, and our operations, we have not seen any major displacement like that. Otherwise, you know, humanitarian agencies that are watching these incidents would have cried out against the UN troops. So asking this, that there is no effect of these operations, I would also ask the question: what if we did not establish these MOBs [Mobile Operation Bases] and TOBs [Temporary Operation Bases]? You know, normally we have something like 12 to 15 COBs [Company Operation Bases], and you should appreciate that. We have established something like 32 MOBs so far. So if you are suggesting that these 32 MOBs in various areas, for one week, have not created any impression...

Summary

SKB Commander: You know, the FARDC thought of going for the integration and the training. They are now just training in two phases. They started with five regiments, and now there is something like eight regiments that are going for the second phase. So they pulled their troops out of the areas of South Kivu. And the resultant effects were certain voids which were created. The population saw the FARDC leaving those areas and they became worried of the reactions by the armed groups. So people then started coming to even our COBs, [saying] that "there, the FARDC are going, we are under threat, and if we are not protected, we will go in the bush, we will go in the jungles." So then, when we discussed with the FARDC, [that was] clear they were not in a position to redeploy, because they have a plan for reintegration, reorganization, and training. So what I decided was to come up with a plan to fill those gaps which were created by the FARDC for training. So we went for four operations -- the 4th one is underway, and three have completed. And basically, these small operations of two to three weeks each were defensive in nature, with the aim of protecting the civilians. So we deployed additional MOBs, additional TOBs, additional SCDs [Standing Combat Operations], and from there, the troops would go out patrolling, meeting the people and creating within the local population a sense of security that MONUSCO is there to protect them.

Question: Are you sure that the population is now satisfied or reassured with your presence?

SKB Commander: You know, the population here in a war-torn country will never be totally satisfied. But how I judge these operations is that when our people were there, there was no displacement of that area; people are living, and the incidents which were reported are merely very small incidents, at times, of theft or one other incident of looting. So there were no major atrocities as such, and we have been able to prevent that. And I am sure that if the population was not satisfied, you would have heard so many stories coming from the humanitarians.

Interview organized and conducted by Biliaminou Alao and Alain Likota/ MONUSCO